I can remember how most of it went with the schedueling of matches, and I think most of us can remember the things that were wrong with it.[19:18] <SSX-Killjoy> but I think there maybe a way to do it wihtout the whole elitism crap
[19:18] <Athrun_Zala> exactly
[19:18] <Athrun_Zala> think it'd be possible?
[19:18] <Tepa> no theres not kj
[19:18] <SSX-Killjoy> yep
[19:18] <Athrun_Zala> so you could get FS2 to talk to a website?
[19:18] <SSX-Killjoy> it just requires alot of maintenance
[19:18] <Athrun_Zala> yeah, that'd probably be the only downside
[19:18] <SSX-Killjoy> to be honest with enough time, I can get anything to do anything
[19:19] <Athrun_Zala> so why not give it a go when you have some spare time (if you ever get some)
[19:19] <Athrun_Zala> it'd be great to have that again, in a controlled environment
[19:19] <SSX-Killjoy> that is what I have been working on since yesterday
[19:20] <Athrun_Zala> neat-o
[19:20] <Athrun_Zala> think you can copy the squadwar model as it was?
[19:20] <Athrun_Zala> a map, nodes, challenging, etc.
[19:20] <Tepa> bd really take look how many ppl still plays fs2
[19:20] <Tepa> id personally say its waste of time to get it running again
[19:21] <Athrun_Zala> hmm i'd have to disagree there
[19:21] <SSX-Killjoy> it depends Tepa, the game is free. So chances are we could get more players
[19:21] <SSX-Killjoy> If we can make it worht their while to play
[19:21] <Athrun_Zala> i think people would be much more involved if there would be something to do there
[19:21] <Athrun_Zala> kj said the same thing
[19:21] <Tepa> installition needs to be fixed more simplier
[19:22] <Athrun_Zala> i think i can actually find the old map somewhere kj.....somewhere being the key word
[19:22] <SSX-Killjoy> well agreed
[19:22] <SSX-Killjoy> but much is in the works to make it easier
[19:22] <Tepa> peeps can just say <censored> it when they cant get it run
[19:22] <Athrun_Zala> actually
[19:22] <Tepa> million diffrent exe's
[19:22] <SSX-Killjoy> if I can make the multi stuff awesome, then I think I can help make it packageable
[19:22] <Athrun_Zala> fahd should have the map he designed
[19:22] <Athrun_Zala> it looked _WAY_ better than the old one
[19:23] <Tepa> lotsa diff VP files
[19:23] <SSX-Killjoy> and if we can make it packageable. then we can put up on fileplanet
[19:23] <SSX-Killjoy> and then we will have players
[19:23] <SSX-Killjoy> probalby mroe than we can handle
[19:23] <SSX-Killjoy> 8-)
[19:23] <Athrun_Zala> it's also possible people would come back once they learned squadwars are back in town and bug-free/maintained
[19:23] <Athrun_Zala> because it _was_ pretty much the main point of the game
[19:23] <Tepa> and pretty much caused all the BS
[19:23] <Athrun_Zala> if kj put his skillz into it, it'd probably be better than the old design
[19:24] <Athrun_Zala> not when you can ban people tepa
[19:24] <Athrun_Zala> anyone who causes crap, gets sanctioned
[19:24] <Athrun_Zala> something we missed back in the day
[19:25] <Tepa> well or basicly its not my concern cuz i dont fly them my SW was prolly last SW matchg on PXO
[19:25] <Tepa> next day sw's were gone
[19:25] <Athrun_Zala> if kj codes it the right way, this could be a very enjoyable aspect of FS2
[19:26] <SSX-Killjoy> plus there is alot of work that needs to be done on player rankings
[19:27] <SSX-Killjoy> to create a formula that is more balanced, than just max number of points
[19:27] <SSX-Killjoy> with a good formula, very few would be able to maintain a best standing
[19:27] <Tepa> also ed needs to force that 1 exe only thing
[19:27] <SSX-Killjoy> it would be constantly changing
[19:28] <SSX-Killjoy> yeah there is alot of things that could be done
[19:28] <CheeseBird> Rankings suck :P
[19:28] <SSX-Killjoy> yes they do.. but some people love 'em
[19:28] <Tepa> so u do tb
[19:28] <Athrun_Zala> rankings are pointless really
[19:28] <Athrun_Zala> but if kj could think something up, i guess they could be made their worth
[19:29] <Tepa> i play coops cuz ppl allways whines when they get asskicked on my games
[19:29] <Athrun_Zala> as it is now, the "points" retarded system, as in just hogging RI, is dumb
[19:29] <Athrun_Zala> actually
[19:29] <Athrun_Zala> i think we should invalidate RI, that thing is retarded to no end, as fun as a mission as it is
[19:30] <Tepa> heh talk to ed
[19:30] <Tepa> i allrdy spoke him with same matter sometime ago
[19:30] <Tepa> he suggested an rotatin mission validate
[19:33] <Athrun_Zala> well we can talk common sense when everything is up and good
[19:33] <Athrun_Zala> KJ, do you remember how www.squadwar.com worked? i think i can remember most of it.....you?
[19:34] <Tepa> tho bd theres 1 minor matter
[19:34] <Tepa> we r not sure did V removed SW code from the source they gave
[19:34] <Athrun_Zala> why would that be a problem?
[19:34] <Tepa> if they did that must be rebuild
[19:35] <Athrun_Zala> well that's what we're talking about i think
[19:35] <Tepa> oh i tought it was just the WWW side
[19:35] <Athrun_Zala> getting KJ to get the game talking to a webiste, and build an efficient system from scratch
[19:36] <Athrun_Zala> if he knows how the previous system worked, he can draw reasonable conclusions and just copy the basic system while making it his own (or something similar to that effect)
[19:37] <SSX-Killjoy> I remember the basic principles of how it worked
[19:37] <SSX-Killjoy> But there are some things I think that shoudl have been handled different, and better.. and so I will try to persue making those kinds of changes
[19:38] <Athrun_Zala> too true
[19:38] <Athrun_Zala> a lot of it was kind of shabby to be honest
[19:38] <SSX-Killjoy> thrown together you mean.. not that I can blame them
[19:38] <Athrun_Zala> but i think i can remember most of it how it worked on the admin side of things
[19:38] <SSX-Killjoy> they did have alot of things they wanted to do
[19:38] <SSX-Killjoy> Right now my concern is making sure the server app we are using for PXO will be able to handle our needs
[19:39] <SSX-Killjoy> and so I have been working on that currently
[19:39] <Athrun_Zala> sounds good
[19:41] <Tepa> i got 1 old SW map
[19:41] <Tepa> NA i thjink
[19:41] <Athrun_Zala> they were all the same if i recall
[19:42] <Athrun_Zala> same number of nodes, etc.
[19:42] <Athrun_Zala> think you can host it?
[19:42] <Tepa> the map is hosted
[19:42] <Tepa> gimme a sec
[19:43] <Tepa> http://koti.mbnet.fi/darkwing/Msg/na.jpg
[19:44] <Tepa> takes a little edit to get fixed
[19:44] <SSX-Killjoy> I think that the node map needs some work as well
[19:44] <SSX-Killjoy> I think each node shoudl have a random number of planets to take over
[19:44] <SSX-Killjoy> before you can have the node
[19:44] <Tepa> cool idea
[19:44] <SSX-Killjoy> so that it helps prevent just mass node taking
[19:44] <Tepa> how bout even add like defence mission
[19:44] <SSX-Killjoy> you could always ahve a node where you have 2/3rds of it, but can't take the last one
[19:44] <Tepa> like attacker has no AIs
[19:44] <SSX-Killjoy> so you can't get it
[19:45] <Tepa> defender has cap ship ?
[19:45] <SSX-Killjoy> maybe
[19:45] <SSX-Killjoy> why not?
[19:45] <SSX-Killjoy> hehehe
[19:45] <SSX-Killjoy> Just and idea I have
[19:45] <Tepa> like mix coop+tvt
[19:45] <Tepa> then actually i migth return :P
[19:45] <Tepa> some thing diffrent
[19:46] <SSX-Killjoy> see, the key to SW is the little touches
[19:46] <SSX-Killjoy> and I think they can be done
[19:46] <Tepa> or massive fights...last 1 who stand wins
[19:46] * Retrieving #ssx modes...
[19:46] <SSX-Killjoy> But, must focus on one issue at a time
[19:47] <SSX-Killjoy> Also things like Pilot Histories (being ablet o access info on previous missions), historical stat tracking, clan/bio/pic setups
[19:47] <Tepa> sounds nice
[19:47] <SSX-Killjoy> Internal FS2 standings request/display
[19:48] <SSX-Killjoy> Kill boards, KOS boards, etc..
[19:48] <SSX-Killjoy> Shivan, Terra, Vasudan types
[19:48] <Athrun_Zala> hmmm can't say i'd like splitting nodes in fractions.....good thing about SW was the simplicity. You win, you get a node. Rewarding at the same time as being simple.
[19:48] <SSX-Killjoy> (snce now you can practically pilot anything)
[19:48] * SSX-MS is now known as SSX-MS`nc2
[19:48] <SSX-Killjoy> not all nodes would be difficult to win BD
[19:49] <SSX-Killjoy> they accounting would be random
[19:49] <SSX-Killjoy> so you would have x number with 1 node, and y number with 2, z number with 3, etc
[19:50] <SSX-Killjoy> and X would be proportionately larger than the y and y would be proportionately larger than z
[19:50] <SSX-Killjoy> so it would be a nice balance
[19:50] <SSX-Killjoy> of easy wins and complex stands
[19:50] <SSX-Killjoy> appease all .. 8-)
[19:50] <Athrun_Zala> yeah, maybe i could bite that
[19:50] <SSX-Killjoy> besides, all of this is just fluff until we can get a system in place that will do what we want it to
[19:51] <Athrun_Zala> true
[19:51] <Athrun_Zala> but dreaming don't hurt
[19:51] <Tepa> another thing would be nice
[19:51] <Tepa> random missions
[19:51] <SSX-Killjoy> which means a system that includes IRC, and stat integration
[19:51] <Tepa> it start to be crap when other picks same crap over and over...infact BORING
[19:52] <SSX-Killjoy> yeah.. good point Tepa
[19:52] <Athrun_Zala> true
[19:52] <Athrun_Zala> but the point of it was to give the defenders the choice
[19:52] <Tepa> mt12,mt12,mt13 all the time
[19:52] <Athrun_Zala> attacker would challenge, defender would set time, mission, number of players, ai or no ai.....
[19:52] <Athrun_Zala> it made sense to give the defender the upper hand
[19:52] <CheeseBird> Do we really want to revive SquadWar? o_O
[19:53] <Athrun_Zala> i sure do
[19:53] <Tepa> they do
[19:53] <SSX-Killjoy> we don't want the old SquadWars
[19:53] <Tepa> i try to offer help
[19:53] <Athrun_Zala> SquadWars v2
[19:53] <Tepa> and ideas
[19:53] <SSX-Killjoy> that pile of crap
[19:53] <Athrun_Zala> true, it was a pile of crap
[19:53] <Athrun_Zala> since it wasn't handled correctly
[19:53] <SSX-Killjoy> but if we improve it, remove some of the things that allowed it to be abused
[19:54] <SSX-Killjoy> I think we can have a very balanced, fun system for just fun games, or even incorporated tourney place
[19:54] <SSX-Killjoy> er.. play
[19:54] <Athrun_Zala> http://koti.mbnet.fi/darkwing/Msg/na.jpg
[19:54] <Tepa> needs new missions tho
[19:54] <Athrun_Zala> that looks like a good generic map
[19:54] <SSX-Killjoy> Imagine being able to setup a tourney and assigning times for each team to take each other on
[19:54] <SSX-Killjoy> Well the mods are out making lots of cool different things
[19:54] <SSX-Killjoy> but right now Fred is a pain to use
[19:55] <Athrun_Zala> i think there are plenty of missions to go from
[19:55] <SSX-Killjoy> but if we built a system that give them a reason to dream up new maps and make them
[19:55] <SSX-Killjoy> I think this could get interesting
[19:55] <Tepa> u can still use old fred to make missions
[19:55] <Athrun_Zala> true
[19:55] <Tepa> just not insert too much too complex event
[19:55] <Tepa> events
[19:55] <SSX-Killjoy> I have heard it is quite buggy with the new stuff
[19:56] <Tepa> just the events
[19:56] <SSX-Killjoy> ahh..
[19:56] <Tepa> when u have tons of diff stuff happening then it runs back to momma
[19:56] <SSX-Killjoy> hahahaha
[19:56] <SSX-Killjoy> well I am sure that could be ironed out if we gave them a reason to focus on it
[19:56] <SSX-Killjoy> 8-)
[19:56] <Athrun_Zala> aye true
[19:57] <SSX-Killjoy> Of course none of this stuff is gonna happen over night
[19:57] <Tepa> no
[19:57] <Athrun_Zala> actually i expect a full working version to be done in the next five hours
[19:57] <Athrun_Zala> get cracking
[19:57] <SSX-Killjoy> But i think with my involvement I maybe able to help pull together a great thing
[19:57] <SSX-Killjoy> but first... nature calls... brb
[19:57] <CheeseBird> TMI
[19:57] <Athrun_Zala> seriously though maybe we should start posting thoughts down on our forum, see what we remember, what could be improved, how, etc.
[19:58] <Athrun_Zala> get some sort of idea going
Now, if this is indeed to fall in Killjoy's hands, we could technically come up with improvements for the actual (what it was) simplistic idea. We could also, get rid of the annoying, unfair stuff that was accompanied by the whole idea in the first place (which Volition never corrected.)
After I get some of my own ideas, I will put them here (most of them for now are pretty basic, I'd just like to re-create the thing without the stuff that made everyone want to be an ass, such as holding nodes indefinetly, or creating unfair times for the opposing team, etc.).
If you have any ideas or thoughts on the matter, put them down, let's see if we can somehow discuss this.
That is all for now.